45 replies to this topic

[Axel]

Eternal slumber, yes, that is what I long for, but the keyword in that statement is "long." I can wait until then, and until that day comes, I'm gonna live my life and do me.

(Shutup, perverts.)

[arimibn]

"shutup perverts"

???

Also. Just an attempt to prevent this from turning into a flame war, I ask that if you have not read everything from the first post, please don't post a reply.

That is how things got out of hand with Furetchen, and I don't want that to happen again.

[Axel]

I could have just seen someone saying, "Oh ho lulz, do yoself? lolzloolololol" or something of the that nature.

[arimibn]

Oh. That's what you meant. You're kinda perverted yourself for thinkin that.

[SmashedFish]

QUOTE (Axel @ Aug 15 2012, 05:19 PM)

QUOTE (SmashedFish @  Aug 15 2012, 04:59 PM) Beyond that, who knows? I wish I could say with conviction that there's a higher plain beyond the gray veil, but no living person can. This is what I believe out reasoning for being here is, we're supposed to find this out for our selves as our lives carry themselves on.

Yeah, pretty much. There isn't a set in stone reason, I don't think. Or there is, but it's large and all-encompassing, so it seems to be different to different people.

[Snow]

QUOTE

Yeah, pretty much. There isn't a set in stone reason, I don't think. Or there is, but it's large and all-encompassing, so it seems to be different to different people.

I believe this as well, there is either one reason that can be understood differently by different people or there isn't a set in stone reason. I'm more inclined towards the first one.

P.S. Arim, cemeteries are a peaceful place and they are great to by in if you want to think or have some quiet time, but if you start thinking about death and how good it is/would be than I think you should stay away for awhile. I would anyway.

[arimibn]

Ironically, that's the reason I'm staying away from the cemetery, because it makes death seem too appealing to me.

[Ristau]

QUOTE (arimibn @ Aug 15 2012, 04:46 PM)

to the person that has died.

Death my end pain, but it won't bring peace. also this should be in the maturity Domain If you were living an awesome life and were at the peak of your existence, and say there is a life after death in which you reflected on it, I myself can say that i'd be really REALLY pissed. I'd no longer get to enjoy life with the people I held dearest too me until their time of passing came along, which could be decades.

That being said, I don't believe in an after life. Meaning that death brings nothing to the person that died.

I hope that this can make you rethink the ideas which you have, because in certain situations, I honestly do not think that there could be any peace for ANYONE that comes from the death of a person.

[Snow]

QUOTE

I hope that this can make you rethink the ideas which you have, because in certain situations, I honestly do not think that there could be any peace for ANYONE that comes from the death of a person.

I don't really know about this because of something that happened in my family but at least you try to stay away from cemeteries, that shows you have a will to live, and (probably, I'm not a psychologist) don't want to die.

P.S. ya this should probably be in mature discussion.

[arimibn]

I didn't post in the maturity domain because the topic wasn't about death. It was about my walk in the cemetery. That, and every topic I make in the maturity domain turns into a flame war, or people end up making me feel suicidal, or someone gets warned, etc.

You don't believe in the afterlife. I do. So essentially, our views on this matter will be different.

I honestly don't see why it's such a big deal anyway. So I think that death brings peace. Big deal. Why are you guys going out of your way to prove me wrong?

Honestly...I make a topic saying I enjoyed my walk in the cemetery, and you and Rijuo go out of your way to make me feel like I'm a deranged psychopath. Well congratulations. You succeeded. I don't know why the hell I keep trying to be "open" about myself. It's just a stupid waste of time.

Every damn time. Every time!

....Phew. I started to lose it for a second there. But anyway, like I said. You have your views, and I have mine, and I'd appreciate it if you could just accept that without trying to go out of your way to prove that my way is wrong.

[Ristau]

QUOTE (arimibn @ Aug 15 2012, 08:17 PM)

you and Rijuo go out of your way to make me feel like I'm a deranged psychopath.

Dude, I would never want that. I'm sorry, forums are supposed to be for discussion, so I thought that you wouldn't mind my input, and then I tried to explain where I was coming from, that's all. I COMPLETELY understand where you're coming from, and it makes total sense. It's just our conflicting views of life after death that structure our arguments. That's all. Sorry if I made you feel that way, because I feel totally bad if I did.

I'm also not trying to prove you wrong, but more so teach you where I come from so that you can reflect on that yourself. I have NO problem if you don't want to/believe that your opinion needs to be changed. I'm not trying to force anything onto you.

[arimibn]

"I hope that this can make you rethink the ideas which you have"

That implies that you think I shouldn't be thinking that way.

"I have NO problem if you don't want to believe that your opinion needs to be changed."

Again, you pointing out that you think my way of thinking is "wrong".

I don't mind input. What I do mind is that every time I try to start up a simple conversation about myself, it somehow turns into an attack on my character. No matter WHAT the beginning topic is.

If you wanted to say, "Well I think this." You could very well have said that, and left it at that. But no.

"Death may end pain, but it won't bring peace."

You were saying that in a way that says, "What you believe is wrong!"

"I don't believe in an after life. Meaning that death brings nothing to the person that died. "

And here you're pretty much saying that because you don't believe in an afterlife, that means that what I think is wrong.

"Please, tell me about the beauty of my sister finding her best friend dead in his closet with a gun in his hand. I really want to hear about how much better the world is because of death."

He CLEARLY is trying to prove that I'm wrong for thinking death brings peace.

"So the various methods of medieval torture are actually good things because, although they caused pain, they ultimately brought relief? The holocaust was good because, even though it caused unimaginable suffering, ultimately the people involved were released from the pain? In comparison to, oh, I dunno, not suffering in the first place? That's bullshit, and you know it."

Please. Tell me how that isn't him trying to prove me wrong.

And I am really starting to wonder why the heck I keep being stupid and posting anything pertaining to my personal life. These conversations continue to go downhill.

I posted a topic saying I enjoyed my time at the cemetery. And I have to feel bad after even this conversation.

I wasn't even upset when I posted this topic, heck, I was HAPPY, and I still walked out of it feeling bad.

[Ristau]

QUOTE (arimibn @ Aug 15 2012, 10:37 PM)

"I have NO problem if you don't want to believe that your opinion needs to be changed." Again, you pointing out that you think my way of thinking is "wrong". .

Actually, it was want to/believe meaning either. NOT Want to believe. I can't tell if you're trying to make me look like a dick, or if you honestly didn't see the slash. It's offending if it's the first.

Also, I'm very blunt. When I said something like "I don't believe in an after life. Meaning that death brings nothing to the person that died. " I was speaking for myself, not what I thought everyone should believe. That, however, was my fault for not wording it so.

Also, I'm not going to debate you on what Rujio said. Only what I said. Sorry if that disappoints you.

[arimibn]

"I can't tell if you're trying to make me look like a dick"

Congratulations. You have made me feel even worse. I'm just going to stop trying to be open about what I think. It's ****ing pointless.

[Ristau]

Dude, seriously. I'm not against you. In fact, I really respect and like you. You just need to be a little less serious, that's all.

Don't always think people are out to get you. ESPECIALLY IN A FORUM ENVIRONMENT! People are BOUND to be passionate and want to give their input and why they think they are right. That doesn't necessarily mean they are trying to persuade you! Now, let's both try to communicate with a little more clarity and be a little less judgemental.

Back on topic, what made you decide to take a walk through the cemetery? If it's nothing you want to talk about, then I won't ask again.


EDIT**

QUOTE (arimibn @ Aug 14 2012, 05:05 PM)

I've been feeling rather...down lately. I don't really want to go into detail though...

If it has anything to do with this then I completely understand any objection and do not want you to feel pressured into doing so.

[arimibn]

No.

All my conversations that revolve about my personal feelings end up turning into arguments. I would much rather keep everything to myself and just be distanced, than end up losing all my friends through arguments.

And I walked through the cemetery because. strangely enough, it felt as though it was calling out to me.

[Ristau]

QUOTE (arimibn @ Aug 15 2012, 11:30 PM)

then end up losing all my friends through arguments.

Fair enough. Although I never think of you differently, for what it's worth. If you ever want to talk about something, feel free to rant it to me on skype, as I do that with a few people I know IRL and online. If not, then have fun with that, and I'm sorry that it came to that.

[Axel]

I don't believe in an afterlife, and you do, but our views on this topic are pretty similar, Arim.

[Rujio]

Firstly, when have I EVER construed you as a deranged psychopath? I have defended you before, and the comment I took real offense to was Pie's. Now, I'm ignoring everything that wasn't directed at me because not quoting 2 pages of stuff.

QUOTE (arimibn @ Aug 15 2012, 01:48 PM)

You misunderstand Rijuo. All you're talking about is the torture. The torture is painful. And I gaurantee you that the people who were being tortured were at peace when they died because they were released from their torment.

You misunderstand me, airmbin. I was making an analogy. Torture causes pain, but ultimately brings peace. Death causes pain, but ultimately brings peace. Would you say torture is beautiful just because of that one aspect, despite all the pain it causes?

QUOTE

You are only speaking of death in the sense of gruesome murder. That is the same comparison as saying all muslims are terrorist because of a select few.

Just to clarify, I was not talking about death within torture, I was making an analogy between death and torture/holocaust.

QUOTE

Death brings peace to the person who has died.

I never said it doesn't. I said that that is not necessarily a good thing, and that that definitely does not make death beautiful.

QUOTE

Think about the many who live lives of suffering. When they die, they are at peace. Death is eternal slumber. And many people are at ease when they sleep. The only time they aren't is when they have nightmares. The only time that death wouldn't bring peace is for a person who is damned to Hell.

The suffering is bad. Death ending that suffering but causing more suffering (more than twenty thousand kids under the age of five die of hunger and related disease every day. That's causing a lot of pain to families) is hardly what I'd call beautiful, and that's ignoring all of the death that cuts of happiness.

QUOTE

While yes, Death is an unfortunate thing for the living, it is essential for the dead.

Well, as someone who believes that there is no afterlife, I must ask: Who cares about the dead? They're dead. They don't feel anymore.

QUOTE

Why do you think people commit suicide? They want to get peace, and are tired of waiting for it to come naturally. In other cases, people are ungrateful with the life of this world, and they can only think of the afterlife, so they kill themselves to try and get to it.

Um, no. Let's revisit my sister's friend, shall we? He was suffering from depression (which everyone thought was fairly minor) and then got really drunk and did some stupid stuff. Then he got sober enough to realize what he'd done, but not sober enough for alcohol to not be a depressant and a dis-inhibitor, so he killed himself. Not wanting peace. Not wanting to get to the afterlife. Depressed, drunk, and appalled at what he'd done.

QUOTE

Like it was said before, most people will not understand the beauty of death until it happens to them.

It's "happened to me" (if we're talking about death happening around us) and I can tell you that it is the ugliest thing I have ever experienced. Y'know, the whole insomnia because of fear, urge to fall over railings, stuff like that? Not good.

QUOTE

And in all honesty, I don't consider suicide to be the same thing as death. Suicide damns you to Hell. Death can bring you eternal peace.

Suicide is a way to die, so, no, it isn't death. But any god who would damn someone to Hell because of suicide is a god who will get no recognition from me. I'm pretty sure that "don't kill yourself to try and get to Heaven!" thing was only put in holy books because, well, people (or the god, I guess) decided that people dieing all over the place was undesirable, rather than actually damning people because they were in a place where they didn't want to live anymore.

QUOTE

Saying the holocaust is good because people were killed?  That's blasphemy. Utter blasphemy. You say death only brings sadness?

Well, if death is so beautiful, then, yes, the holocaust was good because of all the peace it brought to people who were suffering. Never mind that it also caused suffering, since we're ignoring that for death's sake, too.
Death obviously doesn't only bring sadness. Otherwise people wouldn't kill other people. People do that to gain some happiness somehow.

QUOTE

You say that as if people only go to Hell. You say that as if heaven doesn't exist.

Wrong and right.

QUOTE

You feel the way you do, not because you understand death, but because you fear death. You fear death, just as many other human beings do. Humans naturally fear what they don't know. And Death is always the unknown. It only happens to us once, and we cannot inquire from people who have experienced it before. People feel sad about their loved ones dying because it means they can't see them anymore. On top of that, we don't know what happened to them.

See, the funny thing is: I'm not actually afraid of being dead myself. I'm pretty confident that death is not the unknown, but rather nothing. Just as the time before we were born was nothing. Maybe dieing itself doesn't sound so fun, but being dead? Eh, can't be bad.

QUOTE

If your sister became a millionaire and left to live in another country without telling you and never spoke to you again, I assume you'd be just as sad as if she had died, because to you, it is essentially the same thing.

Whoa, whoa, whoa. What? What? What? I.... gimme a moemnt ot fiure aohw to respond.

Wrong wrong wrong wrong wrong wrong wrong wrong wrong. I'll humor you and even assume that situation is plausible, even though there's not the slightest chance that we would break off all contact. There's a whole world of difference between someone I love disappearing off and chasing happiness (presumably that's why she would leave) and my sister never getting to experience anything again. Would I grieve the fact that I couldn't spend time with her anymore? Yes. But not at all the same way I would grieve her death. It would be bittersweet.

QUOTE

When someone else dies, you might feel sad, but that does not mean that the person who's dead isn't at peace. If a person dies during the peak of their life, they usually don't mind dying because they can say, "I lived a good life."

How do you know whether or not they mind dieing? Didn't you just say we can't know what they think? Anyways, I would (hypothetically speaking) be pretty pissed if I died while I was off being happy and accomplishing things because I can't do that anymore. I don't see how neutrality is more positive than something that's positive.

QUOTE

How can you say, "I'd be miserable if I died." if you aren't dead? That's like saying that you know who a person is without having met them before.

Never said that, did I?

QUOTE

But I don't blame you for, like most humans, misunderstanding death because, again, most people will not understand the beauty of death until it happens to them.

That comes of as arrogant. "Oh, I can understand death, but you NORMAL people can't." Yeah.
But I don't blame you for, like many humans, misunderstanding death because you haven't seen it wreak havoc on the lives of you and those you love.

[arimibn]

I already said I'm not going to even try to connect my feelings to others anymore. So stop Rujio. I ask that you just stop.

I'm not replying to anything else about this subject. Or any subject related to anything I feel.