39 replies to this topic

[Rujio]

A few things: What makes you so sure it's a ripoff and not just two people having the same basic ideas? On top of that, being a ripoff doesn't necessarily make something bad. A whole lot of Shakespeare's plays are basically retellings of other (and at the time many well known) stories. People still loved him. In fact, almost anything you might read/see is basically a retelling of some other story. Besides, a lot of what you said is very, very, very simple.

Also, I would argue there is no love triangle in Hunger Games. I don't think there was ever anything romantic between Gale and Katniss and whatever romantic stuff there might have been with Katniss at all gets utterly destroyed in Mockingjay, which leads to one of my gripes with the ending.

And as far as the more detailed characters thing goes, I think that's a very important distinction between the two (again, based on what I've read in this topic). For one thing, BR simply has a lot more material to explain all these characters than HG, and for another: Hunger Games isn't really about The Hunger Games. It's an important part, but the story is about Katniss in the end.

[Holy Kensai]

Too many similarities. And while the writer of Battle Royale has said it doesn't matter, in this topic it was brought up and I defended it. Because it's true.
Shakespeare rewrote the stories as plays and propaganda. He changed the format.
Not everything is a copy. You're just reaching for straws trying to justify it now.
Making it complex would just add little tiny differences. Like location of North America versus Japan. Very small difference.

Okay. And one could argue the love "triangle" in BR was destroyed when boy 2 died, and girl 2 died. And one could argue Battle Royale wasn't about the games, but about Shuya and Noriko.

Hunger Games has three books, covered very characters. Battle Royale has one novel and a manga series based on that novel. Hunger Games had more material.

[Rujio]

QUOTE (Holy Kensai @ Apr 1 2012, 02:01 PM)

Too many similarities.

I know I can't really make much of an argument since I don't feel like watching a movie, reading a book, and reading a manga for the sake of an internet argument, but there really are basic structures that all stories are written around and the only big differences tend to be settings.

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And while the writer of Battle Royale has said it doesn't matter, in this topic it was brought up and I defended it. Because it's true.

Might I ask exactly what "it" is here. What's true? What doesn't matter?

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Shakespeare rewrote the stories as plays and propaganda. He changed the format.

People would hear those stories. They also went out to "hear a play," not to "see a play." Sounds awfully similar to me.

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Not everything is a copy. You're just reaching for straws trying to justify it now.

What's bothering me is this idea that if someone else has an idea before you, you're just ripping them off and don't deserve any credit.

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Making it complex would just add little tiny differences. Like location of North America versus Japan. Very small difference.

Setting can change an awful lot in a story. To go back to Shakespeare, it's not just a coincidence that
so many of his plays take place in Italy.

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Okay. And one could argue the love "triangle" in BR was destroyed when boy 2 died, and girl 2 died. And one could argue Battle Royale wasn't about the games, but about Shuya and Noriko.

This comparison is unhelpful here since I don't know what any of this means. Also, from what I've heard, there's not really anything from BR that isn't directly about the games.

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Hunger Games has three books, covered very characters. Battle Royale has one novel and a manga series based on that novel. Hunger Games had more material.

Hunger Games has at most a book and a half about the Games, and each book isn't particularly long. BR has a book, a movie, and a manga. Manga can be very long. On top of that, if Hunger Games really had more material, I really doubt BR's characters could have been very developed and it could have had anywhere near as much plot as HG. There simply isn't space for dozens of characters to be well developed and have much of a plot in that much space.

[Holy Kensai]

You keep admitting it's out of your knowledge area, and then continue to make wrong assumptions.

There are plenty of possible differences in books. For example; future, rationale, villain, tech, participants, community, volunteers, love story, and violence.

It = Hunger Games being a rip off. The author of Hunger Games is a self-admitting huge fan of manga.

Shakespeare added his own spins that changed stories and based his stories off of history.

See, you're just being stubborn. There's similar ideas and then there are the exact same ideas.

Setting can change things. But the Hunger Games created a setting that was different by title only.

Both love triangles end. Again, it's because you have no idea what you're talking about. The first movie is about the games, and the second movie is about the general world, and has war/rebellion.

See. Here's what you're not understanding. The first movie, the book, and the manga are all the same story. The same story. Not three different stories. One story. Three formats. And yes, Hunger Games was poorly written. Battle Royale was masterfully written, very easy to develop more characters when you know what you're doing and not just ripping something else off.

[Rujio]

I really can't keep up this argument since I don't know enough. However, I looked up what you said about SC being a confessed BR fan, and this is actually the first thing that came up: http://austin.cultur...than-you-think/ . It's even written by a BR fan, although it is specifically about the movies. Also, it links to this: http://movies.ign.co.../1221815p1.html . That one even says that SC claimed to have never even heard of BR before, by the way. Of course, this is the internet and plenty of things could be found arguing for BR, I'm sure. Having read some of this stuff, I've basically come to the conclusion that I like the Hunger Games and Battle Royale is a very similar story. I don't think it was ripped off, though. As pointed out, neither of them are original ideas. The only similarities that could be sort-of rip-offish to me would be the setting and the participants, but there are perfectly valid reasons for those, too.

[Holy Kensai]

I never said HG author was a fan of BR. I said she was a fan of manga. With BR being so popular as a manga, the likelihood of her not reading it and then writing a book series stealing a lot of the ideas is pretty slim.

And yes, HG author does keep claiming she never read it till after she wrote her book.

It's funny, because the first thing I pick out in that first link is "Battle Royale depicts the game as a public secret...The Hunger Games, on the other hand, broadcasts their competition throughout the nation". Which is funny because BR broadcasts the program to the nation, so that shows you how little that person knows about BR.

And the second article leads to IGN. That in itself if a pretty bad point for you. IGN is horribly biased. But I'll treat it as if it was a real source. Okay, so there are a lot of different possible sources a thing or two were taken from and mixed together to create an overall different story. Called Battle Royale. And later HG ripped off pretty much everything, except the collars which are now fire walls and monkeys.

Also, Iron Man is a blatant rip off of Batman. Marvel and DC are well known for ripping each other off and trying to match character for character. Batman is just intelligent and well trained, while Iron Man is spoiled and an ass.

[Rujio]

Edit: You know what, this argument is pointless. I'm not the kind of person to just take someone's word that a book is a ripoff, especially when there are people saying that it isn't as well. I'll decide for myself when I get around to reading BR.

[Golden Warrior]

I'm probably gonna end up doing the same now. And also,

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I must say that I was disappointed with Mockingjay's ending. It just... didn't feel right to me.

THANK YOU! I feel the same way. (She still should have ended up with Gale, my sister says.)

[Rujio]

It might be worth spoilering that. I dunno. Anyways, what I (and my sister) have to say...

You might really disagree, but... (Click Here To Hide/Show Text)

I felt like one of Peeta and Gale (or both) and Katniss should have died. It felt like that was where it was going, and then it just sort of magically got better.

And as far as her ending up with Gale, I vehemently disagree. It wouldn't make sense. There was never really romance between them, I feel, and the fact that Gale was in part responsible for Prim's death (along with his general devotion to the rebellion over Katniss) makes it pretty impossible for them to be together. Of course, the both of them dieing would have solved that problem and Peeta's memory getting screwed up would mean he could just move on with life.

[Golden Warrior]

QUOTE (Rujio @ Apr 2 2012, 09:52 PM)

You might really disagree, but... (Click Here To Hide/Show Text) And as far as her ending up with Gale, I vehemently disagree. It wouldn't make sense. There was never really romance between them, I feel, and the fact that Gale was in part responsible for Prim's death (along with his general devotion to the rebellion over Katniss) makes it pretty impossible for them to be together.

Response time. (You may also disagree.) (Click Here To Hide/Show Text)

Well, consider the events before-hand. Catching Fire, I believe. The part where they kiss? I'm pretty sure there was means SOMETHING.

[Rujio]

However (Click Here To Hide/Show Text)

After that they basically ignore it. It seems to me that Gale really cares about Katniss because they bonded over losing their fathers and having to hunt for their families. Then Peeta comes along, professes his love, and the two go through something even more extreme. He's afraid he'll lose her, which is perfectly reasonable given her performance near the end of the Games, but that doesn't mean he has a romantic interest.

[Dath]

To be honest, I read the books. I liked them, but I don't see why they have this world-wide craze. They weren't really THAT good.

Haven't seen the movie.

[Rujio]

QUOTE (Dath @ Apr 7 2012, 11:16 PM)

To be honest, I read the books. I liked them, but I don't see why they have this world-wide craze. They weren't really THAT good. Haven't seen the movie.

I don't think they were crazy good. I don't know that I'd even say I was 'excited' to see the movie. They were clearly written to leave you wanting more, though, and I think that's what got so many people obsessed.

[Dath]

I suppose that's right. I didn't really like several aspects of the books, either.

SPOILER!!!










Katniss (did I spell that right?) never really seems to find inner strength. She's always clinging on to other characters.

Finnick's death is way to underrated. They needed to expand that. He was my favorite character in the series.






END SPOILER.

[Rujio]

You're aware there are spoiler tags?

See? (Click Here To Hide/Show Text)

I would say Katniss finds her strength in other characters. She doesn't have much will for herself (note her various suicidal episodes) but when it comes to other people, she can really fight.

Finnick's death was so lame. "Oh btw Finnick's dead." I actually had to reread that section to figure that out.

[Dath]

They weren't working for me, for some reason. xP

Same with what you said for Finnick for Boggs.

[Rujio]

You have to put [ spoiler= (text) ] instead of just [spoiler] here.

(Click Here To Hide/Show Text)

Boggs' wasn't as bad as Finnick's for me. It was sudden, but at least had more of an impact than Finnick just being dead all of a sudden.

[Fire Blazer]

I watched the movie, of course, if only because of the huge craze. It was good, but not super amazing, it seemed overrated. I've been meaning to read the books but doing so takes a ton of time that I can't afford to kill right now, so it will be a while before I read the books, if I ever do.

I'm also not too interested in the romance part (even if Katniss' actor is a little hot and I hate Peeta).

[Bobryk]

Jennifer Lawrence is quite attractive.

[Fire Blazer]

...uh

Good point?

XP

Everyone knows 25% of the people who watched the movie did it for Katniss' actress

25% did it because they read the book and wanted to actually see the movie for it

and 50% did it because the other 50% made such a big deal about it that they didn't want to feel left out